apartment therapy changing the world, one room at a time

I own, but my answering the survey may skew the results some -- seeing as how I do not live in NYC.

I own your apartment.

Hmmm... this survey shows a lot about the readers of AT.

I thought, as a sublessee, I'd be in the majority. Wow. The readers are more monied out than I thought.

The survey left out the possibility highlighted in the post: living in an illegal, non-C-of-O, place! (Whether renting or owning it.) It's more common than you think... and most of them are more secure than you think (how many times have the fire department evicted people who live in these places?). I've known families who've lived for decades, and reared children, in such places.

what is non-C-of-O?

i'm not sure where i stand because there is a building owner, and building management, who actually has a lease with the building owner, and i believe we are all sub-leasing from building management. i did, however sign a lease. albeit a pretty flimsy lease.

Not sure it really says THAT much about AT readers. I would assume that most readers would own because why spend a lot of $$$ decorating something you don't own.

Most people, if renting, would only invest in things they can take with them.

powkang,
A "c-of-o" is a certificate of occupancy. It means the city has verified that the apartment/space has met building codes and is suitable for residential occupancy. Sometimes some really beautiful spaces have to rent as "work space only" if they have no C-of-O. Also, those places are much cheaper to buy. I've been in buildings where a few of the tiny studios had no C-of-O and also happened to have a sink but no bathroom. The resident used a (more or less public) bathroom down the hall and everyone pretended not to notice. This went on for decades; there was also some legal mess trying to get the city to certify those units. I can't recall the details, but it seemed to be an interminable and unbelievably complicated matter.

I was once putting some of our things in storage at the Manhattan Mini Storage on Varick, and I saw a young guy go into a space and not quite shut the door behind him. Maybe you should have included 'storage space' as one of the poll answers.

Hey--it seems funny, but it's not. I was one of 68 people evicted by the Brookyln DOB from 247 Water Street in Dumbo for living in nonresidential spaces. It's complicated, but essentially there is no security for anyone living in DUMBO without a residential lease. This sounds like it's the big building on Jay Street, owned by Josh Guttman. If that's the case, watch out. Joshua Guttman worked with the DOB to get us out right around the time that the other big landlord there, Walentas, was getting thousands for his luxe rentals right down the block. JG had always assured us that our leases, despite saying "WORK ONLY" were fine--who would want to live there anyway? he was known for saying. We were all aware it was shaky. Despite a lawsuit which we won (his treatment of us, and the building, verged on criminal), and other lawsuits that are now pending (including one involving a condo building he converted after throwing all the renters out), he still owns half of DUMBO. So if he owns the building in which the sublet of a sublet is hanging out, take care.

I rent an apartment in Philly but since I'm working in Harlem, crash on a friend's couch two nights a week in Brooklyn.

The nominal rent for my nights in Brooklyn: I contributed to buying the couch.

greer,
Yeah, living in tiny storage rooms is a real phenomenon in NYC. I've often seen a bunch of homeless people waiting outside for a storage facility to open, so they could go inside and finally get some sleep. The owners make sure they get kicked back onto the street before closing time, but then they have to let them back in - some storage quarters look downright comfy.

janamartin,
That's horrible. I think the main problem, though isn't so much the non-residential part, as it is the renting a nonresidence. If you owned it and lived in it, I don't think you'd be likely you'd be evicted. But the prospect of the owner making a lot more money by converting the building would put a lot of pressure on the city to evict those subletting non-residential spaces.

And let's not even get into the joys of squatting on vacant property!

I'm afraid I'm squewing your results. I own a co-ownership co-op... in Toronto.

I'm with Wooba... also very surprised at the tiny number of subletters... I know so many people who sublet -- some of them have been in their apts for many years.

I guess my situation qualifies as a sublet - my roommates have held the lease on a loft for more than 20 years, and I rent a room from them.

Not submitting my vote, as I'm in DC, but I rent...

When I first moved to DC I subletted a sublet (i.e. I had a lease with a girl who was subletting from a guy in Seattle that owned the place). It was a disaster when I moved out because the girl pocketed almost my entire security deposit for no good reason, and the landlord ignored my complaints because he had no legal obligation to me. I would strongly discourage subleasing from a subleasee.